Difference between revisions of "039 Plant Rooted Up"

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This page is part of the [[Jesus Database]] project.
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This page forms part of the resources for [[039 Plant Rooted Up]] in the [[Jesus Database]] project of [[FaithFutures Foundation]]
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[[Crossan Inventory]] | [[039 Literature]] | [[039 Parallels]] | [[039 Commentary]] | [[039 Poetry]] | [[039 Images]]
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(3b) IgnPhil 3:1b<br>
 
(3b) IgnPhil 3:1b<br>
 
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'''Crossan analysis'''<br>
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===Crossan analysis:===
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Item: 39<br>
 
Item: 39<br>
 
Stratum: I (30-60 CE)<br>
 
Stratum: I (30-60 CE)<br>
 
Attestation: Triple<br>
 
Attestation: Triple<br>
 
Historicity: -<br>
 
Historicity: -<br>
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== Texts ==
 
== Texts ==
  
'''(1) Thom 40'''
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===(1) Thom 40===
  
<blockquote>Jesus said, "A grapevine has been planted apart from the Father. /2/Since it is not strong, it will be pulled up by its root and will perish." [Complete Gospels]</blockquote>
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<blockquote>Jesus said, "A grapevine has been planted apart from the Father. 2 Since it is not strong, it will be pulled up by its root and will perish." [Complete Gospels]</blockquote>
  
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'''(2) Matt 15:12-13'''
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No copies of this portion of Thomas survive in Greek. For the Coptic version see [[http://www.earlychristianwritings.com/thomas/gospelthomas40.html Early Christian Writings]]
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<blockquote>Then the disciples approached and said to him, "Do you know that the Pharisees took offense when they heard what you said?" /13/He answered, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted."</blockquote>
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===(2) Matt 15:12-13===
  
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<blockquote>Then the disciples approached and said to him, "Do you know that the Pharisees took offense when they heard what you said?" 13 He answered, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted."<br><br>
 
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'''(3) Ignatius'''<br>
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(3a) IgnTrall 11:1b
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<blockquote>Fly from these wicked offshoots, which bear deadly fruit, which if a man eat he presently dies. For these are not the plantings of the Father. /2/ For if they were they would appear as branches of the Cross (and their fruit would be incorruptible) by which through his Passion he calls you who are his members. The head therefore cannot be borne without the limbs, since God promises union, that is himself. [Sayings Parallels, 72]</blockquote>
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(3b) IgnPhil 3:1b
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“Τότε προσελθόντες οἱ μαθηταὶ λέγουσιν αὐτῷ· οἶδας ὅτι οἱ Φαρισαῖοι ἀκούσαντες τὸν λόγον ἐσκανδαλίσθησαν; ὁ δὲ ἀποκριθεὶς εἶπεν· πᾶσα φυτεία ἣν οὐκ ἐφύτευσεν ὁ πατήρ μου ὁ οὐράνιος ἐκριζωθήσεται.” (Matthew 15:12–13 GNT-T) </blockquote>
  
<blockquote>Abstain from evil growths, which Jesus Christ does not tend, because they are not the planting of the Father. Not that I have found division among you, but 'filtering.' [Sayings Parallels, 72]</blockquote>
 
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===(3) Ignatius===
  
== Literature ==
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====(3a) IgnTrall 11:1b====
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== Parallels ==
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== Commentary ==
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===John Dominic Crossan===
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<blockquote>Fly from these wicked offshoots, which bear deadly fruit, which if a man eat he presently dies. For these are not the plantings of the Father. 2 For if they were they would appear as branches of the Cross (and their fruit would be incorruptible) by which through his Passion he calls you who are his members. The head therefore cannot be borne without the limbs, since God promises union, that is himself. [Sayings Parallels] (72)<br><br>
  
Crossan does not discuss this cluster in [[Historical Jesus]].
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Φεύγετε ˹ οὖν τὰς κακὰς παραφυάδας τὰς γεννώσας καρπὸν θανατηφόρον, οὗ ἐὰν γεύσηταί τις, ˹ παραυτὰ ἀποθνήσκει· οὗτοι γὰρ οὔκ εἰσιν φυτεία πατρός. εἰ γὰρ ἦσαν, ἐφαίνοντο ἂν κλάδοι τοῦ σταυροῦ, καὶ ἦν ἂν ὁ καρπὸς αὐτῶν ἄφθαρτος· δι᾿ οὗ ἐν τῷ πάθει αὐτοῦ προσκαλεῖται ὑμᾶς ὄντας μέλη αὐτοῦ. οὐ δύναται οὖν κεφαλὴ χωρὶς γεννηθῆναι ἄνευ μελῶν, τοῦ θεοῦ ἕνωσιν ἐπαγγελλομένου, ˹ ὅς ἐστιν αὐτός. (Trallians 11:1–2 AF-T) </blockquote>
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===Jesus Seminar===
 
 
Some of the Fellows were willing to concede that Jesus may have spoken something along these lines (partly due to the similarity with Matt 3:10: "Even now the axe is aimed a the root of the trees. So every tree not producing fruit gets cut down and tossed into the fire.") However, the saying could also be a proverb better attributed to the common lore of the Second Temple Jewish community. [Five Gospels, 202]
 
 
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===Gerd Luedemann===
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====(3b) IgnPhil 3:1b====
  
Luedemann [Jesus, 192] notes the way this saying accentuates the criticism of Jesus' Jewish opponents, but does not address the question of its provenance until he treats Thom 40:1-2. There (page 610) he attributes Matt 15:13 to the Matthean redactor, and concludes that Thomas is dependent on Matthew for this saying.
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<blockquote>Abstain from evil growths, which Jesus Christ does not tend, because they are not the planting of the Father. Not that I have found division among you, but 'filtering.' [Sayings Parallels] (72)<br><br>
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===John P. Meier===
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Ἀπέχεσθε τῶν κακῶν βοτανῶν, ἅστινας οὐ γεωργεῖ Ἰησοῦς Χριστός, διὰ τὸ μὴ εἶναι αὐτοὺς φυτείαν πατρός. οὐχ ὅτι παρ᾿ ὑμῖν μερισμὸν εὗρον, ἀλλ᾿ ἀποδιϋλισμόν. (Philadelphians 2:2–3:1 AF-T) </blockquote>
 
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Meier does not discuss this saying in the first three volumes of A Marginal Jew.
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== Poetry ==
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== Images ==
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== Work to be Done ==
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Latest revision as of 12:15, 9 December 2011

This page forms part of the resources for 039 Plant Rooted Up in the Jesus Database project of FaithFutures Foundation

Crossan Inventory | 039 Literature | 039 Parallels | 039 Commentary | 039 Poetry | 039 Images



Data

(1) Thom 40
(2) Matt 15:12-13
(3a) IgnTrall 11:1b
(3b) IgnPhil 3:1b

Crossan analysis:

Item: 39
Stratum: I (30-60 CE)
Attestation: Triple
Historicity: -


Texts

(1) Thom 40

Jesus said, "A grapevine has been planted apart from the Father. 2 Since it is not strong, it will be pulled up by its root and will perish." [Complete Gospels]


No copies of this portion of Thomas survive in Greek. For the Coptic version see [Early Christian Writings]

(2) Matt 15:12-13

Then the disciples approached and said to him, "Do you know that the Pharisees took offense when they heard what you said?" 13 He answered, "Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be uprooted."

“Τότε προσελθόντες οἱ μαθηταὶ λέγουσιν αὐτῷ· οἶδας ὅτι οἱ Φαρισαῖοι ἀκούσαντες τὸν λόγον ἐσκανδαλίσθησαν; ὁ δὲ ἀποκριθεὶς εἶπεν· πᾶσα φυτεία ἣν οὐκ ἐφύτευσεν ὁ πατήρ μου ὁ οὐράνιος ἐκριζωθήσεται.” (Matthew 15:12–13 GNT-T)



(3) Ignatius

(3a) IgnTrall 11:1b

Fly from these wicked offshoots, which bear deadly fruit, which if a man eat he presently dies. For these are not the plantings of the Father. 2 For if they were they would appear as branches of the Cross (and their fruit would be incorruptible) by which through his Passion he calls you who are his members. The head therefore cannot be borne without the limbs, since God promises union, that is himself. [Sayings Parallels] (72)

Φεύγετε ˹ οὖν τὰς κακὰς παραφυάδας τὰς γεννώσας καρπὸν θανατηφόρον, οὗ ἐὰν γεύσηταί τις, ˹ παραυτὰ ἀποθνήσκει· οὗτοι γὰρ οὔκ εἰσιν φυτεία πατρός. εἰ γὰρ ἦσαν, ἐφαίνοντο ἂν κλάδοι τοῦ σταυροῦ, καὶ ἦν ἂν ὁ καρπὸς αὐτῶν ἄφθαρτος· δι᾿ οὗ ἐν τῷ πάθει αὐτοῦ προσκαλεῖται ὑμᾶς ὄντας μέλη αὐτοῦ. οὐ δύναται οὖν κεφαλὴ χωρὶς γεννηθῆναι ἄνευ μελῶν, τοῦ θεοῦ ἕνωσιν ἐπαγγελλομένου, ˹ ὅς ἐστιν αὐτός. (Trallians 11:1–2 AF-T)


(3b) IgnPhil 3:1b

Abstain from evil growths, which Jesus Christ does not tend, because they are not the planting of the Father. Not that I have found division among you, but 'filtering.' [Sayings Parallels] (72)

Ἀπέχεσθε τῶν κακῶν βοτανῶν, ἅστινας οὐ γεωργεῖ Ἰησοῦς Χριστός, διὰ τὸ μὴ εἶναι αὐτοὺς φυτείαν πατρός. οὐχ ὅτι παρ᾿ ὑμῖν μερισμὸν εὗρον, ἀλλ᾿ ἀποδιϋλισμόν. (Philadelphians 2:2–3:1 AF-T)